LRP -> high octane ULP?  

Timing is measured in rich and lean hey, well i dont agree with that. I was taught it is retard and advance because you are doing exactly that, changing the ignition timing. I dont have to tell you what you are essentially doing is delaying or advancing the pulse. If you start to associate ignition timing with fuel mixtures it is very easy to become confused and for the average person to think they are infact chaning the fuel mixture.



I never said that pinging couldnt be caused by anything else, what i said was when dropping to a lower octane rating it is better to play it by ear. The drop in octane level does not automatically mean the engine is going to suffer from pinging, in this case where the octane rating has been dropped, it is totally dependant on compression ratios. If on the other hand the engine was suffering from pinging before the change in fuels, i would still have suggested the same course of action, and once the change over occured then the pinging can be dealt with. So in the case i was stating with the drop in octane, it is directly proportional to compression ratio.



VSR and LRP are directly linked. If it wasnt such a problem why would fuel companies, engine reconditioners and manufacturers be issuing warnings?



As for what you were taught about lead, the early fuels were unleaded and had a higher octane rating than the hybrids to follow it. TEL was added to the fuel because quite simply the soft metal was being destroyed under the operating conditions (as i listed above in a brief explaination on VSR). In the past year i can name 7 vehicles in my area that have had guides and seats fail that can be directly attributed to LRP. I dont even know of a local mechanic that reccomends the use of LRP because it is a proven fact that it does cause damage. LRP was meant to be a temporary fix, it was never meant to replace leaded fuels in the long run. It was only during the phase out process it was realised the impact on vehicle numbers running Leaded fuels would be minimal. Therefore the added expense of developing another alternative would be far greater than the returns. If your one for conspiracy theories you could say the big fuel giants were in bed with car companies in an effort to get older vehicles off the road and customers buying replacement models. I of course think that it doesnt hold any merrit.



Anything else you wish to discuss? Would you like me to provide tech docs to support my claims on VSR in another thread?



If iam wrong i will appologise, there have been quite a few threads on another forum dealing with this topic and it is still fresh in my head.

15th February 2003 - 01:35 AM  Reply  Quote

[quote="Bevan Boy"]

Chances are you are probably right to go with just running Unleaded (in terms of potential damage caused). If you are unsure, running UCL isnt going to cause any harm, it may just give you peace of mind. The other possible alternative is to look for any cast marks to designate any change of design of the head itself. Any reference number may be handy to trace back between revisions and alterations. Still try to get a hold of the bloke who did the rebuild, if he did the work himself he will be full of knowledge that you can carry over to the engine in your vehicle. If he didnt do the work, he should be able to tell you the name of the rebuilder who did. Quite often they dont mind a chat, maybe shout him a drink or two

15th February 2003 - 01:40 AM  Reply  Quote

i wasnt the one saying timing was measured in rich and lean!!! you were but anyway i am sick of fighting about it!!!

15th February 2003 - 06:13 PM  Reply  Quote

I must appologise, i missed out causing.

15th February 2003 - 10:53 PM  Reply  Quote

ohhhh i didnt no dat, i thought all premium was 98

17th February 2003 - 12:59 AM  Reply  Quote

I dont know what we are complaining about, the US their normal unleaded is 89 octane, and they reckon some dodgy places go as low as 86 octane. They dont really have a 98octane pump fuel.

17th February 2003 - 01:24 AM  Reply  Quote

ULP 91min

LRP - 96min

PULP -95min

Super PULP 98min.

BP sell av gas for road use (ie not aircraft use) which is 110 if i can remember. Laws have been passed finally giving a minimum manufactured rating.



Yeah cams, the states is about the only country in the world with shittier fuel than ours Now you know why they are fans of big 90 degree 8's and buick 6's

17th February 2003 - 04:10 AM  Reply  Quote

Using ULP in my 308 torana, was good for a while (ie a couple of years), but now funnily enough i have very noticable exhaust valve leaks, and i'm sure the intake wouldnt be sealing properly either (has a cch288 cam, so the intake valves are pretty much open all the time) it all depends on what car. YES lead does soften the blow of the valves onto their seats, and because i have been running optimax since its conception, it has now FUCKED IT!! (ps the engine has only done 8000km since rebuilt which included a 3 angle valve seat job!!!)



so maybe in rotarys its fine (no valves let alone valve seats!!!) but i wouldnt be giving the advice that it is fine to use to anyone. i'm sure i wouldnt be to happy fucking a cylinder head because i listened to some guy on a forum..but since it takes a LONG TIME to slowly damage valve seats, they would have forgotten who told them anyway.....



Hey does anyone care that this car wouldnt have a catalytic converter!! IE its illegal to use the fuel without it. let alone the fact that without it the car is emmitiing carcinegenic Benzene rings.. cool, yeh your car might do a 20.1 second quarter as opposed to a 20.2, but youll grow another head!!!!!

17th February 2003 - 07:17 AM  Reply  Quote

[quote="March_Hare"]

QUOTE

QUOTE yeah not sure about the head couldnt ge onto the guy either flow 410hp and i have an edelbrock manifold and 750 Holley carb and massive cam but that doesnt help u much so if i dont run UCL with it what can happen? Chances are you are probably right to go with just running Unleaded (in terms of potential damage caused). If you are unsure, running UCL isnt going to cause any harm, it may just give you peace of mind. The other possible alternative is to look for any cast marks to designate any change of design of the head itself. Any reference number may be handy to trace back between revisions and alterations. Still try to get a hold of the bloke who did the rebuild, if he did the work himself he will be full of knowledge that you can carry over to the engine in your vehicle. If he didnt do the work, he should be able to tell you the name of the rebuilder who did. Quite often they dont mind a chat, maybe shout him a drink or two

Cheers

Spoke to the guy

didnt no much about the head but when i asked about fuel he said he changed the valve stems and seals so that it could run on unleaded

17th February 2003 - 07:22 AM  Reply  Quote

changed the stems? Sounds like he knows even less than you think. Seals arent anything to worry about. Did you mean something else?

18th February 2003 - 12:22 AM  Reply  Quote

i just switch from LRP about 6 months ago.. we took my heads off and the LRP had left an orange colour build up in my heads etc etc, now my mechanic said to run premium with flash lube and... wow, no more orange shit and the car runs nice and crispy now i advise premium with flash lube to any one thinking about it

18th February 2003 - 04:24 AM  Reply  Quote

I just run LRP in Brutis2, if you are so worried about going faster that a +2 RON rating makes you hard in the pants, I suggest you get a real car

18th February 2003 - 08:32 PM  Reply  Quote

i'm running BP ultimate + valve lube, in the mk1 capri with no catalytic converter, its legal and it runs fine have had no probs with the valve seats and it runs slightly hotter than it did when u could buy leaded, i'm thinking of running avgas only, damn fuel company's bring back 110 octane leaded like what the car ran back in the 70's damn it



it just goes to show how some people think they no everything when they really don't have a clue there is so much wrong information in this thread and only a small amount of correct info

*looks at blown 13b*

19th February 2003 - 11:00 AM  Reply  Quote

You can no longer buy avgas for commercial use. It is usually packaged in 20L or 205L drums and contains a high lead content fuel with a high octane for high performance engines with high compression ratios and for vintage or classic cars, which like the low volatility. It is illegal to use "Avgas" in vehicles on public highways. It is sold in drums for use at racetracks and off road racing events approved by one of the following organisations: Confederation of Australian Motor Sport (cams), National association of Speedway Racing ,Australian National Drag Racing Association, Australian Karting Association or Motorcycling Australia.



So unless your a member of either of the above associations, your chances of getting any "Avgas" is pretty remote.

19th February 2003 - 03:09 PM  Reply  Quote

fuck sik_EBIIghia sorry i made a mistake but i still stick with my beliefs on the whole VSR thing because i can honestly not recall seeing it on the motors we did!!! but man we all make mistakes look at you for instance you bought a ford falcon!!!! that was my opinion be it right or wrong!!!

19th February 2003 - 08:23 PM  Reply  Quote

mach_hare i know this allready

and blown13b settle down its the internet for fucks sake,

there was alot of other incorrect posts too not just yours



it shows lack of brain power when it comes down to people using what car another person drives as an attempted insult, lame dude at least think of a better comeback

btw i dun own a falcon, i drive a 1970 capri GT and i used to own a fairmont ghia but it got stolen

20th February 2003 - 02:00 AM  Reply  Quote

I was just replying about it because i have 74L left and i cant get any more till another meeting Loaded up the tank before i left, put the car on a trailer and went home



As for your capri, you need a Mk III with a 302w mate

20th February 2003 - 02:44 AM  Reply  Quote

isnt that capri ur sisters ??

sorry dude just joking!

rescetp to the capri! nice car those!

u have pics??

20th February 2003 - 07:45 AM  Reply  Quote

sweeet

yeah that is no suprise

those v6's were a great package!

as soon as i get my radiator i am going down the coast for this sunday arvo cruise!

20th February 2003 - 11:15 AM  Reply  Quote