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 Sr20de & Sr20det & Sr20ve Differences. - Differences in Na and turbo bottom ends. help.  

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Mr Ruski
  • Mr Ruski
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  • Joined: 14-April 11
  • Posts: 24
  • From: Brisbane
Post #1 post 29th August 2011 - 04:39 PM
Sup everyone,

Need some advice on differences in Sr20de and det engines. Now i know there is obvious differences like compression, oil lines, internals and ECU.

But i am unsure of the difference in the NA block and the DET block. Do they have the exact same dimensions?? are they the same material. I was once told that the NA SR's had a pooftenth smaller bore block than the turbo but i didnt believe it. I need to know from someone who knows for sure.

I'm currently on my p's and have an s13 with the sr20de out of an s14 with VCT and all that shit, but have been saving for when i get off my p's to change the motor to a turbo, probly an s15 blacktop, and eventually turn it into a sr20VET with the pulsar or bluebird VE head.

But if i can utilise the bottom end and some components of my NA motor it will save me a few grand that i can put into more important shiz.

thanks for looking.

This post has been edited by Mr Ruski: Aug 29 2011, 04:41 PM
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iamhappy46
Post #2

Firstly, FWD and RWD blocks are VERY different. The VET conversion to a DET motor is basically a complete new bottom end as well, since you need a new collar to suit the VE oil pump and then oi llines etc. Welcome youself to a whole world of pain if you go VE+T wink.gif

Ok, so the RWD DE and DET bottom ends are different. The DET oil pump flows more oil at the same pressure, the DET also has piston oil squirters(google it if ya want to know what they are)
The blocks are physically the same size, the bores are IDENTICAL yet is is actually the DET piston which is smaller as it has more heat expansion wink.gif

Seriosuly though, you are better off finding a complete SR20DET motor and building that in preperation for fitment. Rip the DE motor out, fit the DET and then sell the DE motor off to another P plater for about what the DET will cost to buy lol.

DE runs 9.5:1 compression, DET runs 8.5:1 compression(Gtir pistons are same as DET, but the GTiR combustion chamber takes compression to 8.3:1, VE head will increase compression)

Bluebird never had a VE, it was the P11 Primera, N15 VZ-R or the Nissan Wingroad smile.gif P12 Primera or Xtrail head is slightly more complex. All options will require a P12 or T30 crank angle sensor to work.

Edit: Also the DE and DET upper sump pans can be different due to a different block skirt design. Some DE motors have the DET block and DET upper pan etc.

Mr Ruski
Post #3

hmm, perhaps it would be better to buy a turbo blacktop.. Yeah the sr16 head will bolt onto my SR with the conversion aswell, but i was more looking at getting the 20VE since you can pik them up for like $900 bucks from ebay as apposed to the VZR motors that go for $2000.

The VVL conversion is still a long way away, but Mazworx sells full Kits to bolt the FWD head onto the RWD engines:
http://www.mazworx.com/product/vvlve-conve...-conversion-kit

They are a bit expensive but at least in includes the whole DIY kit, i think theyre the only company that manufactures it...

iamhappy46
Post #4

Unless you are going all out, the difference from DET to VE+T is not all that much for the major expense. Sure, its nice to say you own a VET(hell, I have owned 2 and been involved in 4 others, including a megabuild right now) and the added airflow + solid lifters etc with a suyitabl size turbo, you are better off converting to E85 and getting similiar power wink.gif

Mr Ruski
Post #5

Thanks for the info bud.

Mr Ruski
Post #6

Did you say you own a VET?? and vet motors make heaps more power than det's!! from what ive seen anyways...

but you would get even more with a VET on e85 LOL..

iamhappy46
Post #7

I owned a genuine X-Trail GT(they have 206Kw on 6psi boost stock and horribly detuned due to running an AWD CVT auto trans) but managed to get it up to 253awkw with a HKS GT3037S Pro and rebuilt box, the cars new owner has a manual conversion done with a little more boost, absolutely rips all over the Porsche Cayenne Turbo S his neighbour owns.

My other genuine VET had/has 541rwKw at 8800rpm on 28psi with E85 assisted by a GT42R back in 2005/2006, I still own that motor but nothing worth putting it into after the original shell it was in got destroyed as I used to drive it on a local beach sad.gif
So to answer your question, yes E85 + VET = EPIC wink.gif

The megabuild is a billet tall deck SR20 block, with a 105mm stroke, 92mm bore with Darton sleeves, P12 Primera head(ported to flow 347cfm@28Hg with 13.2mm lift), custom 288 degree high lobe intake and 292 exhaust cams, VET headgasket, Cosworth head bolts, dry sump, 6 bolt mains etc. The block is also machined to take an LS1 6 speed manual wink.gif Owner invested $25K into the build, not cheap but it will become a dedicated drag car eventually wink.gif

Mr Ruski
Post #8

Fuck yeah thats awesome!! Why put an RB into a silvia when you can get SR to make same power figures?? How did u get the LS gearbox to fit to the SR?? thats interesting.. and which bottom end did u bolt the head onto?? blacktop or redtop?? sorry to hear about your old car. Im sure that your SR will go strong in a nice silvia or datto...

iamhappy46
Post #9

Genuine VET's are AWD style, like the GTiR. I had mine in rear engine, rear wheel drive like an MR2 with a Primera 6 speed FWD gearbox powering the rear wheels smile.gif

The megabuild is a complete billet block similiar to this:


It should be a super quick S14 haha.

Visforvagina
Post #10

^^ matt knows his stuff

QUOTE (iamhappy46 @ Aug 29 2011, 10:25 PM) *
My other genuine VET had/has 541rwKw at 8800rpm on 28psi with E85 assisted by a GT42R back in 2005/2006, I still own that motor but nothing worth putting it into after the original shell it was in got destroyed as I used to drive it on a local beach sad.gif
So to answer your question, yes E85 + VET = EPIC wink.gif


yeah hey, that tends to happen when the car gets impounded after spraying sand all over 2 off duty cops beach fishing then it does rusts away while in impound yard oopsie.gif

QUOTE (iamhappy46 @ Aug 29 2011, 10:25 PM) *
The megabuild is a billet tall deck SR20 block, with a 105mm stroke, 92mm bore with Darton sleeves, P12 Primera head(ported to flow 347cfm@28Hg with 13.2mm lift), custom 288 degree high lobe intake and 292 exhaust cams, VET headgasket, Cosworth head bolts, dry sump, 6 bolt mains etc. The block is also machined to take an LS1 6 speed manual wink.gif Owner invested $25K into the build, not cheap but it will become a dedicated drag car eventually wink.gif


Anyone local?

Mr Ruski
Post #11

That sounds pretty cool. Didnt you say you had an ls1 gearbox onto your SR?? also, how did you set up an engine in the back of the car?? that would be a lot of messing around. Would be a mad turnout though, it would be like those old school peugot or renault rally cars...

iamhappy46
Post #12

QUOTE (Mr Ruski @ Sep 1 2011, 06:29 PM) *
That sounds pretty cool. Didnt you say you had an ls1 gearbox onto your SR?? also, how did you set up an engine in the back of the car?? that would be a lot of messing around. Would be a mad turnout though, it would be like those old school peugot or renault rally cars...


The billet block allows you to run the ls1 gearbox, billet alloy means you can machine the block to have extra holes etc.

Ever seen a Totyota MR2? They have the Celica/Camry 2L 4cyl motor in the rear, with the FWD gearbox just powering the rear wheels instead of the front wheels.
ie like this:
Mr Ruski
Post #13

Yeah i know what you mean. Is that in your old car? looks like a real tidy job mate. Just didnt know what you meant with the LS gearbox because if it was to be in the rear of the car, you would need a FWD gearbox...

Also i was needing to ask you, if i wanna build a VET motor, should i begin with a blacktop SR or Redtop?? becuase doesnt a blacktop hav a lowmount intake and the redtop has a highmount? i was looking on the Mazworx site and they build custom intakes for the VET motors that are used on RWD motors, and the VE head looks to me like a highmount.. So i was thinking of just buying a redtop because of cost and just putting the rest into rebuilding it.

Is there any benifit of having a blacktop bottom end as opposed to redtop or are they both the same?

Cheers man.

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